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Post by Britbrat on Oct 25, 2004 11:05:20 GMT -7
1. What customer purchased the last 5 Boeing 707s to be built & what were they used for?
2. What was the primary difference between the XF2Y-1 & the YF2Y-1?
3. What was notable about the YF2Y-1's career?
4. What was the UF-XS & what was its production descendent?
5. What was the first aircraft to simultaneously refuel four other planes in flight?
6. What aircraft was the engineering progenitor of the Tupolev family of jet bombers?
7. What was a "Retreiver"?
8. What modification to the KC-135 saved the USAF 22 million gallons of fuel/year?
9. What was the largest seaplane in production during WWII & what particularly noteworthy combat accomplishment did it achieve?
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Post by jetmex on Oct 25, 2004 13:15:54 GMT -7
2. The XF2Y-1 was the prototype Convair Sea Dart, was powered by two Westinghouse J-34 engines and incorporated a twin ski type landing gear. The remaining four Sea Darts were YF2Y-1, were powered by the more powerful Westinghouse J-46, and were fitted with a single ski to reduce the buffeting encountered while on the water.
3. The YF2Y-1 became the first seaplane to go supersonic on August 3, 1954.
4. The US-XS was a prototype Shin-Meiwa four engine, flying boat, whose development led to the PS-1/US-1 production aircraft.
8. The JT-3/JT-8 engines were replaced by the more fuel efficient CFM-56 high bypass turbofans.
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Post by Britbrat on Oct 25, 2004 13:25:31 GMT -7
Jaime:
#2 -- ya got it
#3 -- yes to the supersonic bit (it is the ONLY seaplane to exceed Mach 1), but one more bit of notariety to go
#4 -- yes so far, but there was something unusual about the US-XS
#8 -- nope
Better hurry -- Galvin will wake up from his nap
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Post by jetmex on Oct 25, 2004 15:51:53 GMT -7
#4--The US-XS had Wright engines on the outboard positions, and P&W engines inboard (or was it the other way around? ;D ). In any event--two manufacturer's engines installed on the airplane.
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Post by Galvin on Oct 25, 2004 23:52:42 GMT -7
1.) The last airplane of the original 707 design series to be delivered was an E-6 "TACAMO" (TAke Charge And Move Out) version for the U.S. Navy, which has a total of 16 E-6s. The E-6 airframe is a modified Boeing 707-320B with CFM-56 engines. It features a very-low-frequency (VLF) dual trailing wire antenna system to permit one-way, emergency communications to submerged submarines.
The VLF system includes an onboard power amplifier-coupler connected to two wire antennas, one about five miles long and one slightly less than a mile long. When deployed, the antennas trail behind and below the aircraft. After deployment of the wires, the aircraft banks sharply and flies a circular orbit that allows the longer wire to hang as vertically as possible to enhance signal transmission.
3.) The first YF2Y-1 disintegrated in flight and none of the other YF2Y-1s completed were ever flown. The XF2Y-1 was brought up to very nearly YF2Y-1 standard and testing was continued for a while with it. It was eventually parked also. The program ended in 1957 but in 1962 the X and YF2Y-1s were redesignated as F-7s even though they had been parked, cancelled, and all but forgotten for five years.
I used to see one of the prototypes parked on the old Navy seaplane ramp at Lindbergh Field in San Diego back in the sixties. It sat there for years but disappeared one day and I heard it was headed to a museum. I assume it is one of the four surviving Sea Darts on display in various places around the country.
4.) The UF-XS was the proof of concept prototype for what later became a production flying boat. In addition to the fact that it had Wright 1820s inboard and P&W 1830s outboard, it was based on a heavily modifed Grumman Albatross airframe. It also had a turbine engine mounted in the upper fuselage to run the boundary layer control system. The production PS-1 was an entirely different airplane that relied heavily on the design and used components of the Martin P5M Marlin flying boat, a much larger airplane. It was also entirely turbine powered and also had a turbine powered BLC system.
5.) The Convair R3Y "Tradewind" was a large four turboprop-engine powered flying boat intended to be a "flying LST" but which became just another aircraft whose mission had disappeared even before the first aircraft flew. Eleven aircraft were built and about six of them had a bow door that opened for loading and unloading of cargo. Some were modified as tankers and in 1956 one of them carried out the first simultaneous refueling of four Grumman F9F-9 "Cougar" jet fighters.
6.) The beginning of the line for Tupelov's series of heavy bombers (and transport aircraft) that started with the Tu-4 "Bull" and and ended with the Tu-95 "Bear" was the fortuitous (for the Russians) force landing of three examples of the Boeing B-29 bomber in Russia after they had received battle damage in raids over Japan.
The B-29 was the state of the art in long range bomber design at the time and although the Russians had requested them under lend lease, their transfer to the Russians had been refused due to the increasing concern of the U.S. government over the postwar plans and ambitions of the Soviet government under Stalin.
The estimation was that the copying of the B-29 and the resultant presentation to Stalin with the beginnings of a long range bomber force later cost the U.S. alone billions of dollars in countering a threat that did not exist before 1946 when the first Tu-4s, the almost direct copy of the B-29, appeared. The airplanes were so similar that at one point Russian agents were caught in the U.S. trying to obtain B-29 wheels and brakes.
The fact that the Russians had developed an atomic bomb in the fifties and an airplane that could deliver it from the Soviet Union (admittedly only on a one way suicide mission) led to my having to do "duck and cover" drills for almost my entire elementary and high school career.
7.) The Piasecki HUP-2 "Retriever" was a twin rotor helicopter, often carrier based, used by the U.S. Navy for plane guard, air rescue, and COD duties back in the fifties and sixties.
8.) It comes from re-engining most of the remaining KC-135 fleet. The KC-135 R and T versions are modifications of the original KC-135 A and use the military version of the CFM-56, the F-108CF-100. The KC-135E version uses the Pratt and Whitney TF-33-PW-102 turbofan engine
9.) The largest production seaplane of WWII (13 Built) was the Blohm und Voss Bv-222 "Wiking". The most notable of its combat accomplishments was the carrying of large amounts of cargo to the war zones and many wounded back, first in Norway and then in the Mediterranean. One was taken on charge by RAF squadron 201 at the end of WWII for a short time.
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Post by Britbrat on Oct 26, 2004 5:37:28 GMT -7
I told you guys to get going before he finished his nap.
Jaime -- you essentially got #4 & the honour is yours, but that Galvin critter topped up the bin.
He also got #1, the second half of #3, #5, #6, #7, #8, & a good part of #9.
However, the Bv 222 has a unique air combat accomplishment that Galvin has somehow failed to detect. Come on guys, you've had a brief reprieve.
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Post by propnuts on Oct 26, 2004 10:23:24 GMT -7
One of the YF2Y-1's is on display in front of the San Diego Air and Space Museum. I looked through the site for a picture of it parked at the front on a pole, next to the SR-71. I didn't find a picture but it shows on the chart on this page. www.aerospacemuseum.org/exhibits/tour.html |
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Post by Galvin on Oct 26, 2004 11:05:10 GMT -7
I didn't find anything particularly spectactular about the aircraft's combat history other than the fact that one of them once shot down a Lancaster over the bay of Biscay. It may have been notable due to the fact that the Bv-222 was never that heavily armed.
Large bombers and flying boats sometimes encountered their enemy counterparts when on patrol and it was not unusual for them to pull alongside and blast away at each other in some sort of aerial reenactment of an ancient sea battle. There are several famous pictures of Japanese flying boats being shot down by B-24s and Privateers after what amounted to running gunfights. The Shorts Sunderland, which the Germans dubbed the "Flying Porcupine" for the number of guns it carried, had a few kills recorded as well.
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Post by Britbrat on Oct 26, 2004 14:52:02 GMT -7
Ya got it!
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Post by jetmex on Oct 26, 2004 18:43:07 GMT -7
One San Diego Sea Dart, coming up:  |
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Post by Galvin on Oct 28, 2004 9:56:37 GMT -7
I also forgot to say that I dispute the idea that the Bv-222 was the largest production flying boat of WWII. The Martin "Mars", two examples of which still survive, was a considerably larger aircraft having a wingspan of 200' in contrast to the 150' span of the Blohm und Voss boat.
The first XPB2M-1 was basically a stretched PBM and, after having the guns and turrets removed and being redesignated as the JRM-1, served the U.S. Navy in a transport role until 1945 when it was relegated to training duties. The design therefore definitely qualifies as the largest flying boat to see service in WWII and was the first of a production series. The extensively redesigned JRM-1 "Mars" first flew in June 1945 and a total of five were built with the last being the only JRM-2, all being christened with names in the manner of ships. Interestingly, ALL of the Bv-222s were considered prototypes or pre-production prototypes and were different from each other to varying degrees.
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Post by Britbrat on Oct 28, 2004 10:54:33 GMT -7
Galvin, I am aware of the status of the Mars prototype, but the Mars production run didn't begin until 1946. The Wiking was the largest flying boat actually in production during the war. Only the first 6 Bv.222's (Bv.222A & Bv.222B), built in 1940/41, were prototypes. These were powered by six 1,200 hp BMW 323R radials. The "C" varient was the definitive production version & continued in production until 1944. This machine was powered by six 1,000 hp Jumo 207C 12 cyl opposed diesels, & had a top speed of 242 mph @ 16,000 ft, a ceiling of ~20,000 ft and a patrol range of 5,655 miles. Following the end of the production run in 1944, 2 Bv.238 prototypes were produced, these being powered by 1,750 hp DB 603V 12 cyl radials -- giving a top speed of 264 mph @ ~20,000 ft & an impressive range of 8,700 miles with a patrol bomber combat load.
With regard to the Lancaster shoot down -- the Bv.222C varient that did the deed was heavily armed, having a mix of 7.9 mm, 13 mm & 20 mm guns, with the top turret 20 mm gun being directed by a FuG.216R "Neptun" radar. The much faster and more agile, but lightly armed (6 x .303) Lanc made a fatal mistake in attempting to intercept the heavily armed Wiking.
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Post by jetmex on Oct 29, 2004 6:23:57 GMT -7
If you really want to get picky, the first JRM-1 Mars flying boat (Hawaii Mars) was built in June 1945 and did see service before the war ended, so you could say that this was the largest production flying boat of WWII. This airplane was destroyed in an accident in August 1945, and five more were built. Two of them (Phillipine Mars and the second Hawaii Mars) survive today as fire bombers in Canada.
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Post by Britbrat on Oct 29, 2004 6:36:12 GMT -7
Jaime, he doesn't need any help! ;D I have had the pleasure of seeing the Mars water bombers on Vancouver Island. BIG!!  |
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Post by Galvin on Oct 31, 2004 2:00:24 GMT -7
I don't know if the aircraft that shot down the Lanc was a C version or not. Before I even did some more digging on the subject I was already aware that the armament of the BV-222 had been considered totally inadequate. After a couple had been shot down by fighters the aircraft were ordered to only fly in close formation so as to more effectively cover each other and at low altitude so that their vulnerable undersides were protected. After this proved fruitless and a couple more were shot down or damaged, the remaining aircraft were pulled from service around February of 1943.
What I didn't know and subsequently learned was that one of the reasons they were pulled was to increase their offensive amament and by June, 1943 they were back at work. The Lancaster was shot down in October of 1943 so it was obviously a victim of a BV-222 which had a been given a substantial increase in armament compared to a few months before.
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Post by Britbrat on Oct 31, 2004 16:51:51 GMT -7
Back to the Mars -- "Seaplanes and Flying Boats", by Bill Yenne, BCL Press, 2003, states -- " In 1943, without having flown a single combat mission, the prototype had its power turrets removed, and it was converted into a transport. No further patrol bomber Mars were built, but the US Navy ordered 20 Mars transports under the designation JRM-1. None of these were completed before the end of the war, however, and the order was cut to five".
Looks like the Wiking was the largest wartime production flying boat, especially considering that the Mars prototype was substantially different from the actual production models.
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Post by jetmex on Oct 31, 2004 18:29:45 GMT -7
Guess it depends on where you get your info: www.vectorsite.net/avmars.htmlI think I'll stick to my guns, since the the JRM's were production airplanes, no matter how they differed from the prototype. Remember, production B-17s differed substantially from the prototypes also.... |
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Post by Galvin on Nov 2, 2004 13:07:08 GMT -7
That was where I got some of my info, Jaime. The rest is in one of my "Wings of Fame" volumes in an article titled "Mariner, Mars, and Marlin variants".
The navy ordered 20 JRM-1 transports in 1944 and the first was completed and flown in June of 1945, the war ending two months later in August. All were delivered after VJ day but most were definitely in production prior to the war's end.
The first part of the original question was "What was the largest seaplane in production during WWII" not "what was the largest seaplane to see service or combat". The second part of the question was "& what particularly noteworthy combat accomplishment did it achieve? " and assumes that the first part is true, which it is not.
Therefore the BV-222 was the largest production seaplane to see service and combat during WWII but not the largest one in production during that period.
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