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Post by Tim McTigue on Aug 24, 2004 9:38:35 GMT -7
My wife has been cleaning out the crawl space this week, and getting rid of a bunch of stuff, which means going through just about everything. Yesterday she pulled out something I was amazed to see I still had...
What I remember about my early efforts at C/L is that I built a Sterling Ringmaster Jr. when I was about 13, and although I kept it hanging around until after I was married, I never managed to fly it. I also recalled I had built (mostly) another kit that I had gotten for Christmas around that time, but couldn't remember the name of it. I did remember that it was all-wood, meaning that the wing was solid balsa, but with the controls inside, with carved-out channels for the leadouts. Yesterday I got a reminder... my wife had found the construction sheet/instructions. It was a Carl Goldberg Skat Rat. I remember I never quite completed that model... I got as far as carving out the leadout channels, and I think I even mostly assembled it, but never finished it. If I had, I would have tried it with my McCoy 35, which I still had at that time.
Ah, nostalgia. Interestingly enough, the plans refer to it as a "Rat Racer/Sport plane". I think it would've been one heck of a hot sport plane!
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Frank
New arrival
To Chicken to Fly Over Asphalt
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Post by Frank on Aug 24, 2004 11:08:06 GMT -7
Hi Tim, Just found this place. ;D Know what you mean, recently discovered a couple of plans (lost since I moved from England). one is for a chuck glider "no name" the other for a free flight "Dizzy Diesel". Built both designs eons ago. Have come C/L plans also...they have yet to turn up.  |
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Post by jim on Aug 24, 2004 17:50:27 GMT -7
Is the Skat Rat the one where the plan shows the leacouts laced through the bellcrank so they will fatigue and break sooner rather than later?
Jim
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Post by Tim McTigue on Aug 27, 2004 9:42:02 GMT -7
Jim, it's the very one. I didn't know what you meant until I looked again at the plan last evening, and even then I had to study it for a few minutes till I found the diagram you're referring to. I couldn't believe my eyes! Instead of showing the leadouts attached individually to the bellcrank, even with crimps (let alone wraps), it shows the leadouts as one continuous wire that would begin at the wingtip, travel up the wing, in one side of the bellcrank, through a hole in mid-bellcrank, then through the other side of the bellcrank and out to the wingtip again. Brother! I don't recall if I ever got as far as installing the control system, but even in my naive young years, I doubt if I would have put any trust in doing it that way! I wonder if anyone ever did it that way? The result would be pretty predictable, I think.
Jim, you're the only other person I've ever known who apparently has seen one of these planes. I've never seen it mentioned anywhere. Guess it wasn't too popular, at least among the folks I've known...
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Post by Britbrat on Aug 27, 2004 10:14:52 GMT -7
Ah --memories. I've never seen a Skat Rat, but I had a much love Ringmaster & McCoy .35. Amazingly it lasted quite a few years -- I built it in 1959 & it last saw action in 1970. I also had a very long-lived TF Flightstreak that I attempted to convert to RC in 1967 -- & that was the end of that! I haven't flown C/L since 1970, but I am getting the urge.
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Lightning
Listener
R/C Combat flier aka.Lawn Dart king
Posts: 91
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Post by Lightning on Aug 27, 2004 11:22:21 GMT -7
Ah --memories. I've never seen a Skat Rat, but I had a much love Ringmaster & McCoy .35. Amazingly it lasted quite a few years -- I built it in 1959 & it last saw action in 1970. I also had a very long-lived TF Flightstreak that I attempted to convert to RC in 1967 -- & that was the end of that! I haven't flown C/L since 1970, but I am getting the urge. Hey Pat - airplanes last a long time when you hang them from your workshop ceiling - it's your flying efforts that put them in Jeopardy ;D ;D ;D As to the Flightstreak, it's my hunch that you ran it up on the ground, got the fuse all oily and it slipped out of your hand when doing the nose-up mixture check  Shoulda had lines on it - it would only have got 60' away before you could maybe regain control ;D  ;D |
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Post by Britbrat on Aug 27, 2004 16:45:19 GMT -7
Ah- - Keithy me lad, I must admit that you make me laugh! ;D I was flyin' combat when your diapers were still wet. It's this wicked RC stuff that causes the troubles in the world.  When you've got the world on a string, tied around yer finger, ye Know which way is up ;D ;D |
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Post by Britbrat on Aug 27, 2004 17:14:30 GMT -7
Bye the way, lightning old lad -- I've only had 6 prangs this year -- all repairable (with a bit of effort)  , & two don't count 'cause they weren't my planes  . How many dirt-naps have you taken this year olde son?  |
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Lightning
Listener
R/C Combat flier aka.Lawn Dart king
Posts: 91
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Post by Lightning on Aug 27, 2004 18:00:54 GMT -7
Hey Pat, if you're counting unscheduled ground contact due to anything other than violent contact with another airplane trying to occupy the same space, then the answer is Zip, None, Nada, Zero, even nought. (which only a Pommie would understand!) ;D ;D I came back from the US combat nationals with two damaged wings and a chewed fin - after 30 rounds of combat ; all due to mid-airs. Our meet last weekend was almost as damaging - flew eight rounds and had two wings to fix - mid-airs again, one of which was my choice to land as my wing was at 30 degrees to the fuse!! So you started flying before you were six eh!! |
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Post by Britbrat on Aug 28, 2004 6:41:13 GMT -7
Actually I was about six when I started flying -- admittedly minus engines, but those castor-lubed rubber bands were mighty powerfull. ;D
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Lightning
Listener
R/C Combat flier aka.Lawn Dart king
Posts: 91
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Post by Lightning on Aug 28, 2004 6:47:48 GMT -7
Ah yes, the smell of castor all over your hands ;D ;D ;D. I graduated to Jetex by the time I was eight, first with a Jetex 35, then moved up to the searing power of a Jetex 50. Managed to blow it up when I did not get the igniter fuse wire out of the jet fast enough - burned the airplane (and that was the end of that - deemed too dangerous by the all-knowing parents  ) Couple more years of rubber power until I got my first engine - a Frog 150 diesel - that went on a Mercury Marvin C/L plane. (See, I hadn't drifted completely away from this thread topic ;D ;D). Had to rig up some blocks that I could leave the plane against, engine running, while I ran back to the handle, gave it a tug off the blocks and took off from there. Had a hard time finding helpers back then!! |
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Post by Britbrat on Aug 28, 2004 9:05:01 GMT -7
My first C/L model was a modified rubber-powered Cornell trainer that I fitted out with a Torpedo .035 -- it was about 1950. I pretty much wore out the .035 & replaced it eventually with a McCoy .049 for 1/2A C/L stunt flying, then a series of Cox, K&B & OK Cub engines. I also had a Holland Hornet .049 for 1/2A speed. I had other adventures with Jetex 50 & 150 powered free flight & really "big" free flight engines -- a Super Hurricane .24, a Merlin Super B & an O&R .19 -- all "sparkies". They were eventually flown in primitive R/C models, then converted back to glow C/L engines. The pinnacle of my C/L glow engines was a hopped-up McCoy .35 Red Head that got used for everything immaginable (combat included) & a howling Dynajet that was actually rather terrifying.
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Post by minnesotamodeler on Aug 28, 2004 12:46:07 GMT -7
it shows the leadouts as one continuous wire that would begin at the wingtip, travel up the wing, in one side of the bellcrank, through a hole in mid-bellcrank, then through the other side of the bellcrank and out to the wingtip again. Brother! I don't recall if I ever got as far as installing the control system, but even in my naive young years, I doubt if I would have put any trust in doing it that way! I wonder if anyone ever did it that way? The result would be pretty predictable, I think. Tim, I actually have used just such a LO system for several years, and have yet to notice any unusual wear. Mine are installed in plywood bellcranks, which may make the difference (no sharp edges for LOs to work against). On the plus side, this method eliminates two connection points and their potential--no matter how small--of failure. I'd be interested to hear others' viewpoints on the issue. --Ray |
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Post by bigiron132 on Aug 28, 2004 13:38:30 GMT -7
Hi Tim. Yes I have seen the type of LO shown on the Skat Rat used. Yes I have seen them fail. That kit was the answer to Riley Wooten's Quickie Rat. I personally never used that Leadout system, but saw several whpo did and a few which failed. I designed a Scat Rat several years before the Skat Rat came out. Mine was a full fuselage upright mounted engine. Designed around the Green Head K & B Torpedo. Then later Johnsons and lastly the G21-36 Tigre.
Bigiron
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Post by jim on Aug 28, 2004 17:31:45 GMT -7
I have a copy of the plans for Marvin's rat. a nice, good flying airplane, which I first saw fly in 1958. I have used wooden bellcranks in small airplanes for some time. I have had the wood eat through leadouts, so now they all have copper busings.
Jim
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Post by minnesotamodeler on Aug 29, 2004 13:12:37 GMT -7
[quote author=Jim I have used wooden bellcranks in small airplanes for some time. I have had the wood eat through leadouts, so now they all have copper busings.
Jim[/quote]
Jim, surely you mean the leadouts ate through the wood, not vice versa? (I haven't yet seen either problem).
--Ray
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Post by jim on Aug 29, 2004 19:36:35 GMT -7
Nope, the wood ate through the leadouts. I did not expect that. I was using 018 control line for leadouts at the time. I now use some leader material that is a bit heavier, and bush the wood, as I said.
Jim
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Post by zekemccoy on Aug 29, 2004 20:15:48 GMT -7
Since we are talking about all wood rat racers, I saw one win the nats in 1975.
Pete Mazur had his 'Blunderthird' all wood upright HP.40, twin tail-boom design. Hardwood dowels hung under the wing, extending rearward to hold the tail. This was competing against pan rats.
The name came from it being the third in a series of blunders.
HP.40 was a hot engine in its time, how do they stack up nowdays? That was 29 years ago.
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Post by minnesotamodeler on Aug 30, 2004 7:07:42 GMT -7
Nope, the wood ate through the leadouts. I did not expect that. I was using 018 control line for leadouts at the time. I now use some leader material that is a bit heavier, and bush the wood, as I said. Jim Huh...I have a hard time picturing that, not that I don't believe you. I use .021 or .027 cable for leadouts, depending on weight of the model, weaving it completely through the bellcrank and out the other side (one continuous wire, 4 BC holes) and have never had problems--but I will watch closely for signs of it. As has been said, we live and learn (hopefully). --Ray |
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;D
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When you've got the world on a string, tied around yer finger, ye Know which way is up ;D ;D
. How many dirt-naps have you taken this year olde son? 
